Play It Again Sam

[Yoda]

Okay, guys, we're gaining on it. Butafter reading Martee's above post, we've still got some fog to deal with.Happily, much less than before. However...we've got to be 100 percent onthis understanding of the Basic Motion of a hinge or we've got no businessgoing any further in this study. The jungle only gets deeper and darkerfrom here. Remember the Tarzan Principle:

"Never let go of Vine #1 until Vine #2 is firmly in hand."

So, I've reprinted Martee's post and will take the points made one by one. Mycomments are bold-faced.

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Yoda:

Martee stands corrected for referencing Horizontal to the vertical surface. Igot sucked into the problem.

Great! That is why we are here!

The motion itself is being refrerenced to the Horizon (Horizontal, Vertical andAngled, though this could be either.

The term horizon refers to the horizontal plane. It does NOTrefer to the vertical or angled plane. Remember, the word isHORIZON-tal.

The Plane is being referenced to the horizon. The Hinge Pin should be referenceto either the horizon or more correctly IMO to the motion.

There are actually THREE Basic Planes being referenced, only ONE of which isreferenced to the horizon. Namely, the HORIZON-tal Plane. The remaining two are-- and also by definition -- the VERTICAL and ANGLED planes.

Perpendicular or at a right angle to the motion is what I was trying to conveyor say.

Right! The hinge pin is ALWAYS VERTICAL -- PERPENDICULAR --to ONE of theTHREE Basic Planes. But this includes the vertical plane as well, NOT just thehorizontal and angled planes. Therefore, the hinge blade is also vertical toone of the Three Basic Planes. Your soon-to-be-educated Flat Left Wrist willjust love that last sentence very soon!

The reference to the plane would be much simpler and clearer if it is stated asif it were perpendicular or at right angles, CAUSE that would be the samereference in mechanical terms that would be used.

Well, isn't that exactly what I've said? How else can I say it? I've saidthat the hinge pin is always vertical -- or perpendicular -- to one of theThree Basic Planes of Motion. Go to your dictionary: Vertical is definedas "At right angles, or perpendicular, to the plane of the supportingsurface."

Normally you would reference the Hinge Pin in relationship to the motion of theHinge, not to an external reference. the plane.

The motion made by the hinge blade CANNOT be separated fromthe plane of that motion. They are one and the same! The CHARACTERISTICMOTION of the hinge BLADE -- horizontal, vertical or angled -- is defined byTHAT particular plane of motion. And the hinge pin is ALWAYS VERTICAL -- or perpendicular-- to the hinge blade's DEFINED plane of motion.

Vertical motion, referenced to the horizon would require a Horizontal Hinge Pinor a Hinge Pin that is at right angles, perpendicular to the motion.

For once and for all time, there are NO HORIZONTAL HINGE PINS in TheGolfing Machine. There are ONLY VERTICAL HINGE PINS. We are NOTreferring to how the pin relates to the horizontal plane. Except, of course, inhorizontal hinging -- in which case -- it is vertical. Which should comeas no surprise because, per the above, the pin is ALWAYS VERTICAL to the planeof motion of the rotating hinge BLADE! A hinge pin cannot be bothhorizontal and vertical to a given plane of rotation at the same time.Quoting Homer, "This garbage must surface (2-S)!"

Horizontal motion, referenced to the horizon would require a Vertical Hinge Pinor a Hinge Pin that is at right angles, perpendicular to the motion.

That's the ticket!

Angled motion, referenced to the horizon (could argue it is referenced to theVertical, but that would be an indirect reference to the horizon) would requirea Complementary Angled Hinge Pin or a Hinge Pin that is at right angles,perpendicular to the motion.

What you've said is almost correct, but Yoda recognizes low-lying fogwhen he sees it. You 'see' the angled plane of motion, and you also 'see' thepin at an angle. Hence, you 'see' a "complementary" (to the plane)pin. An angled pin. But...Listen up everybody! -- just as there are NO HORIZONTALPINS in The Golfing Machine, there likewise are NO ANGLED PINS!There are only -- all together now shout -- "VERTICAL PINS!" Yodathanks you.

This is the same way you saw -- in picture #2 -- a vertical plane and itsVISUALLY "horizontal" pin. Which horizontal pin you went on todescribe as being perpendicular -- or vertical -- to the vertical plane. And itwas! But...we don't describe the hinge pin of a given plane by its relationto ANOTHER plane! We are interested ONLY in how that pin is positioned inrelation to the plane of motion of ITS OWN blade! And for any given hinge, its pinis always DEFINED as being VERTICAL to the plane of motion of its BLADE.

Sorry to side track the topic but my understanding is that Hinging is not aswell understood as it should be and I feel that the wording choosen couldcontribute to that.

No side tracking with these questions and comments. This is exactlywhy we are here! Thanks for asking them. We are all benefiting from thisdiscussion; it has further clarified the basic motion of a hinge and explainedhow the terminology is absolutely correct. And your photos are fantastic.Without those visuals, we couldn't have 'hammered down' these foundationalprinciples. Thanks again!

We probably won't agree on the words, but we agree based on the acceptance ofthe pictures that we are on the same page regarding the hinging action.

We MUST agree on the words! If we don't agree here, Vine #2 will break!

Again, sorry to side track the topic.

No sidetracking here. This starship is moving North.

"First star to the right andstraight on until morning!"

-- James Barrie, Peter Pan